14C28N Vs 440C Knife - edcTopic.com Nitro V is also significantly cheaper than many other steels with this level of performance. For more information, please see our rust resistance.Best of all most knives made from this steel can be had for well under $75.In my opinion Sandvik 14c28n is a better overall steel than that of Aus8,420hc,or ANY of the . VG-10 steel also has the same level of toughness as 14C28N and the same level of corrosion resistance. 440A has more chromium in solution along with a small addition of Mo, but has significant amounts of carbide so the two are an interesting comparison. Anthony Sculimbrene authors the blog EverydayCommentary.com. What it is: D2 is a carbon tool steel with a relatively high chromium content, prompting some to call it a "semi-stainless" steel. rex 121 If the properties of a knife meet your knife needs and it has the above characteristics, then it qualifies as a quality knife. When the blade gets messed up I just replace it. And Mn and Si isnt shown at all for the high alloy steels, even though those elements are added to all of them. It's like the difference between average 420HC and Buck's 420HC with the Bos heat treatment, only from a better starting point. Im a woodworker and Im interested in making better performing plane irons and chisels. 14c28n Steel Review - Knives & Gear Read more about how it works here. Most steels use carbon to increase hardness, but 14C28N uses nitrogen, boosting hardness without the normal penalty of increased corrosion. 9Cr18MoV steel Review - Everything You need to Know - Materials Today Oh, thats great, thanks. Maxamet and Rex 121 are so extreme in terms of wear resistance and edge retention that I rated them higher than 10 because otherwise it throws off the ratings for everything else. s30v n690 This is an old high-carbon (non-stainless) steel. Its a very hard steel and is exceptionally difficult to sharpen. AEB-L It can dull your edge, cause pitting, and damage the structural integrity of your knife. The steel is similar to Sandviks 13C26. Old time 8670, 5160 (known to ignoramuses as 51shitty) and 52100 are excellent choices and arguably better choices than 80crv2. Its hard to imagine a more rust-inducing environment than saltwater and fish guts. Without any confusion, you can purchase this set that has a slim, versatile, modified drip-point blade with good slicing capabilities. REX 121 is a powder steel produced by Crucible. Hi Larrin, thanks so much for writing this blog and putting so much reliable information into such an accessible form. A2 is a tool steel renowned for toughness. I was wondering if the 14c28n sample was also prequenched like the AEB-L toughness samples? You do not expect the prices to be as low as those of low-end knives, but you will get high performance at affordable prices with either. Low Carbon steels like AEB-L wont hold up to wood cutting even though it can hit 64 hard, it just doesnt have enough Carbon.. Toughness is a measure of how much resistance a steel has to fracturing. Working closely with our factory the heat treating of this steel has been perfected resulting in excellent performance for the price. D2 steel also resists chipping better than most stainless steel types. For decades, different steels have been made to fit this category. It should get an ultra-sharp edge for easy cutting, hold the edge for long for easy maintenance, and have a sturdy and ergonomic handle for comfort and to prevent accidents. However, in our testing there is a reduction in toughness by using the high temperature range rather than the low temperature range, such as was found with CPM-CruWear (Z-Wear) or CPM-10V. It is certainly possible for a knifemaker or heat treating company to do a heat treatment that will have suboptimal properties. its like with cars, most of them are not a corvette or a porsche. Steel ratings are not about ranking steels in terms of what is better than another, but understanding the different balances such as toughness vs edge retention. Im writing a book about choosing a knife for EDC. These steels have sufficient toughness to handle thinner edge geometry. and yet millons of knives are being made out of 1.4116 (aisi 420mov?) Not to sound like a ship, but these two knife inspiration makes this an eye-catching knife. vanax The highest edge retention steel was Rex 121 which was at 70 Rc in combination with lots of high hardness vanadium carbides. The benefit of this, of course, is that the steel holds an edge for a very, very long time. This is one of the fundamental tradeoffs in steel. Actually, Id be thinking 14C28N, but I want to leave stainless out. If you want to learn more about a specific steel, you can click it in the sorted listings below. I also have meat cleaver 1,4116 ,58RC that I order and was looking up if its a good steel or did waist money and need to return it. 14C28N is a type of high-performance stainless steel used in knife-making. However, Kershaw asked Sandvik to make their 13C26 steel more resistant to corrosion, and the result was 14C28N. This particular steel grade allows for the highest attainable hardness without. BD1 isnt terribly hard but sharpens easily. And steels with at least 10% chromium are probably stainless, except for several important exceptions like D2 and ZDP-189. You cannot leave your 14C28N knives in water overnight and expect them not to rust. After the steel is quenched it is reheated to a lower temperature to increase toughness and decrease hardness. Less expensive, conventionally produced steels include VG-10, D2, 154CM, N690, and 440C. I also added a few more steels in this study. This list is not exhaustive, so check out some of our rating tables for more information on whatever steel youre interested in. Wear resistance, be it high or low, is the most significant determining factor in ease of sharpening. Im looking forward to seeing if it does as well in full production. As a side note, pure tungsten carbide blades (from brands like Sandrin) can have very high levels of edge retention, but they are not made of steel. But which? Spyderco is the only production company using this steel, though Michael Gavik of Gavko knives produced a number of customs in LC 200N. In particular, I really care about the toughness / hardness part. In my experience, it will tarnish and discolor quickly. Have you tested K390 sufficiently to be able to rate it? Other factors that can be added in are corrosion resistance, hardness, and cost. By that I dont mean that a better heat treatment is not possible, but that major mistakes in heat treating are avoided. Is there some way we might predict the relative "effective toughness" of different steels at different hardness and at different edge angles? Hes already done a three part series on cryogenic treatment: 14c28n vs D2 Steel. Despite its wonderful performance, XHP is actually not terribly expensive compared to other high-end, all-around performers. As a result, there are no production knives with REX 121 steel, though Ferrum Forge used the steel early on in its custom knives and a Kickstarter knife from the Creely Brothers. But unlike most high-end steels, SPY27 is an easily user-serviceable powder steel. Also D2 is not stainless as at least 5% of its chromium is tied up in carbides where it doesnt help prevent corrosion. By signing up for email newsletters, you agree to GearJunkie's, Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to email a link to a friend (Opens in new window). The only thing putting me off immediately buying the p135 is the 14c28n steel. And given the recipe, it has a low number of carbides, the extra-hard microcrystals in steel that provide the hardness necessary for a stable and sharp edge. a burr might have developped on some of the steels and not on others, it might have ben reduced or even removed by the process. Steel high in carbides cant be stamped out; it must be cut by a waterjet or laser, which takes time and is more expensive. While 14C28N and D2 are both pretty to look at, buyers always regard one over the other. For example, the Si space is blank for several of the carbon steels because they have a relatively wide acceptable range, not because the element isnt added. 14C28N vs D2: Which Steel Is Better? - Knifeful.com A hunting knife has a singlepurpose: processing meat after akill. For the steels that I rated I give them a single rating rather than a range based on different heat treatments that can be performed. The main downside is the steel is more difficult to heat treat and can't go harder than about 60 or perhaps 61 Rc. Its found on a large number of traditional-style folders. Below shows the results of MagnaCut testing vs other steels where it is labeled as New Steel.. If you're stuck between 14C28N and 440C, here's a breakdown of the pros and cons of each type of steel. Hello everyone I've been loking into twosun knives recently. Developed by New Jersey Steel Baron, Nitro V is a non-powder steel marketed as an enhanced version of AEB-L. Nitro V, as its name indicates, adds nitrogen to AEB-Ls formula to make the steel even more corrosion-resistant. They tend to be relatively expensive and difficult to sharpen, as they have high wear resistance. Though technically not a stainless steel due to its composition, in use it performs exactly like one. To reiterate the clearer part, I wonder if toughness increases faster than edge retention decreases as an edge gets thicker. Now that is power planer blades, but the principle stands, less carbon and alloy isnt the best for wood working and Id use a steel like 26C3 (1.25% C .30%Cr) for my hand tools and temper them to around 62 hard and use the best angle for wood shaving, not the best angle for cutting rope. When describing the characteristics of a steel, a few common attributes are commonly talked about. Theres a green triangle at about RC 60.5 and toughness over 40. Thanks to Bill Smutz, Alex Topfer, Florian Bachler, Brunhard, Art, Rod H, Sach, Jinny Koh, Jon Duda, Cory Henderson, and UPKnife for becoming Knife Steeel Nerds Patreon supporters! can you strike twice as fast with the knife? Thats a tiny difference, but in combination with the 420HC disparity, it conceals a full point difference between 420HC and 440A: 7.6 vs. 8.6. The steel comes with increased wear and abrasion resistance properties. What is the Best Budget Knife Steel? - Knife Steel Nerds Now 14c28n is IMO the best budget steel out there. Advantages: Toughness, edge retention. VG-1 is a non-powder steel made by Japanese specialty steelmaker Takefu. Both of those things are no longer an issue as I now have way too many articles and a book. However, D2 steel has better edge retention, while 14C28N offers a better sharpening experience. We use a subsize, unnotched chapy test with 2.5 x 10 x 55 mm dimensions. While 9Cr18MoV steel is highly corrosion resistant due to the addition of Cr, and Mo. The most balanced is CPM-MagnaCut which is in an area all by itself on the chart. Time and use have proven this to be quite accurate. Also, if you want a fishing knife, 14c28n steel will survive better in wet areas than D2. Everything you need to know to buy the right knife for the job. It is among the best steel that will offer exceptional toughness while still maintaining excellent corrosion resistance. However, Kershaw asked Sandvik to make their 13C26 steel more resistant to corrosion, and the result was 14C28N. This can turn the ultra corrosion resistant LC200N or Vanax into a normal stainless steel that will rust with only 1% saltwater. 14c28n vs vg10: What's The Best Steel - Knifeyellowpages With a high level ofedge retention, corrosion resistance, and toughness, it does most everything quite well. 1% saltwater will separate between other stainless steels. Or, is this perhaps a historically useful practice that made sense on softer/less tough steels, but would make less sense on some newer steels that can be used at higher hardness and thus higher edge stability? 14C28N steel is known to offer among the best if not the best toughness in knife steels out there. Plus the charts get messier, and I dont always have data for a wide range of hardness values. Lately Ive been edcing one of those instead of a nice folder. A quick check shows the compositions of these steels are nearly identical, so based on that Id expect them to perform similarly (differences in heat treat and blade geometry aside). If youre looking for all all-around best knife steel, youd be hard-pressed to find one better than Bohler Uddeholm M390. I personally don`t care about stainless (sic! Different heat treats have emerged over the years, but one has risen to the top as the best:Bob Doziers D2. A Japanese powder steel, ZDP-189 is essentially the polar opposite of 3V its uber-hard instead of uber-tough. 14C28N and D2 knives are affordable high-end knives. at least it has some vanadium over the 420hc. I would suggest adding a second axis to the ratings charts that show the data values that the 0-10 ratings are based on (unnotched charpy impact energy, 1% saltwater , Total cards cut, etc.). 14c28n vs d2 : r/chineseknives - reddit Read more. To view the purposes they believe they have legitimate interest for, or to object to this data processing use the vendor list link below. Rust Test includes:D2 from Bestech and WE1095 from shop8Cr13Mov from Spyderco420HC from BuckWalmart knifeY Start (Marked D2)Follow me at:Twitter: https://twi. The material increase machinability and strength. The ratings in this article rate ease of sharpening primarily based on wear resistance, but if a knife is difficult to sharpen, there may be other factors in play. My test is for comparing different steels, not necessarily for a go/no go test for saltwater applications. Why do you give a coin with a knife as a gift? HA! GiantMouse Vox/Anso ACE Iona Liner Lock Knife, Muley Freaks Erik Van Woerkom Charged With Felony Possession of Trophy Mule Deer, The Biggest Improvement to My Camp Kitchen Is a Mini Pizza Oven (But Not for Pizza), Propane Traeger, Moosejaw Coolers, Hybrid HOKAs, Adventure Chess, and More Emerging Gear, Avalanche Outside British Columbia Resort Buries 10, Kills 3 Heli-Skiers, Netflix Unveils First Trailer for Tour de France Series. Spyderco announced Native 5 Salt with magnacut, but I saw test of magnacut with salt water and it grows corrosionso Salt with magnacut could be a flop. I did a large study of different knives with identical sharpening and edge geometry. There are significant differences between them because 14C28N is stainless steel, while D2 steel is a semi-stainless tool steel. Is there a reason SG2/R2 are not included in the lineup, despite being one of the most popular ones? This is an American-made powder steel produced by Crucible and developed specifically for knives with the aid of the knife guru Chris Reeve (maker of the vaunted Sebenza, among other gems). Note that corrosion is detrimental for the cutting edge. 14c28n vs d2 - Which Model For Best - Knifeyellowpages It applies to both of course, hence why there isnt a separate label. Below shows Vanax tempered at 400F on the left and 1000F on the right after 1% saltwater for 24 hours: There are many other ways in which knife steel performance can be reduced through heat treatment but I cant cover them all in this article so hopefully these illustrative examples will be enough. Start comparing steels. Another common heat treating choice that is not even categorized as a mistake is tempering in the high temperature regime (~1000F) rather than the low temperature regime (~400F). But its lightyears ahead of the alternatives, specifically titanium-bladed knives. 1. first there might have been some annealing going on (even if its was a microscopic level) and the steels might have reacted differently. This is a very important factor when selecting a steel for your knife blade, especially if you plan on spending a lot of time outdoors in an area with high humidity.. S30v is a higher ranked steel and considered a true Stainless Steel, with a 14% .